The Internet Coming Full Circle?

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 07:26:20 -0500 last edited: Thu, 08 Dec 2022 18:42:18 -0500

In a way, we are going back to how the internet used to be. We started with things like Usenet and email discussion lists. Discussions were federated via email and you did not have to log into any particular website. Anyone with an email address could participate, and admins moderated the groups individually.

Fast forward to today, and we have things like Hubzilla, Mastodon, and ActivityPub. And anyone can participate by creating a federated social media account, and admins of each instance moderate their own instance. Just like the old days, except with better technology.

So, in a way, we have gone full circle. Younger people may not remember the days before Facebook, Twitter, Friendster, Google Plus, Vine, etc., but some of us do. As long as these networks federate, I think decentralized social media will be just fine.

federation fediverse community

show all 10 comments

lotfi

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 09:59:51 -0500

No need to talk in the past tense. I still manage two mailing lists for associations in which I'm a member. In both cases because it's still the best solution to accommodate those who are very comfortable with new communication tools (social networks, messaging, etc.) and those who are either allergic to them or boycott them for political or other reasons... For the moment, moderated discussion lists are the most popular among groups of people with different profiles or of different generations.

Scott M. Stolz

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 10:12:45 -0500

@lotfi

No need to talk in the past tense.

True. I just meant that back in the day, you only had two choices. Usenet, which was federated, and discussion boards, which were (typically) not federated. As such, most of the internet participated in one or the other, or both.

What is interesting is that to younger people, who grew up with smart phones and modern social media giants like Facebook and Twitter, the whole concept of federation is new to them, yet federation is how it all started.

Scott M. Stolz

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 10:48:03 -0500

@lotfi

I still manage two mailing lists for associations in which I'm a member. In both cases because it's still the best solution to accommodate those who are very comfortable with new communication tools (social networks, messaging, etc.) and those who are either allergic to them or boycott them for political or other reasons... For the moment, moderated discussion lists are the most popular among groups of people with different profiles or of different generations.

What's interesting is that discussion (mailing) lists could be integrated into Hubzilla as an additional protocol, if someone cared to write one. Then the discussion list would have both an email interface and a web interface.

And apparently, Usenet newsgroups and the Network News Transfer Protocol (NNTP) are still alive and kicking. Since you can add new protocols to Hubzilla, it might even be possible to add Usenet, if you have the right server setup. NNTP needs a specific port, so it probably wouldn't work on shared hosting, but would probably work on a VPS.

Just random thoughts. I am just amazed at how extendable Hubzilla is, if someone wanted to build it.

lotfi

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 13:20:15 -0500

I dream so much about getting my friends, family and colleagues to adopt Hubzilla /streams. For now, I'm still far from that feat.
If I could do that, there would be no need to embed a discussion list in the software. Hubzilla /streams are, in my opinion, more than enough, as they are, to replace communication by email, or any other alienating social network.

Scott M. Stolz

Tue, 06 Dec 2022 13:49:12 -0500

@lotfi

I dream so much about getting my friends, family and colleagues to adopt Hubzilla /streams. For now, I'm still far from that feat.
If I could do that, there would be no need to embed a discussion list in the software. Hubzilla /streams are, in my opinion, more than enough, as they are, to replace communication by email, or any other alienating social network.

That's the beauty of federation. If they get on anything that federates with Hubzilla or Streams, you can talk to them. Sure, it would be ideal if they get on Hubzilla or Streams, but that is not the only option.

The current challenge is: how to we get people who are not technical on the platform?

Scott M. Stolz

Thu, 08 Dec 2022 18:41:50 -0500

@lotfi

No need to talk in the past tense.

I am going to update the original post so that it says "started with" instead of "used to have" since these technologies still exist.

Mike Macgirvin

Fri, 09 Dec 2022 04:13:18 -0500

The current challenge is: how to we get people who are not technical on the platform?

Make the platform less technical.
Teach them.

kris

Fri, 09 Dec 2022 06:13:50 -0500

I vote for option 1.

Because I need to be teached hummm tought anyway you understood. I am dreaming for an app that would do 10% of hubzilla but with ease.

Scott M. Stolz

Fri, 09 Dec 2022 07:01:13 -0500

I think that, the more one uses Hubzilla, the more one realises, more efficient ways to use it. Just like doing anything that one enjoys doing, one must do it often enough, until it becomes second nature. So, unless one is about to die soon, suddenly, there is an inordinate amount of time to learn, how Hubzilla works just by using it often, many times per day. Prove me wrong.

That may be true, and that is true of anything, really. But that does not help new users. And, quite frankly, it is this attitude that stalls adoption rates and kills perfectly good projects. People have a choice of what platforms they use. Are they going to use one that is easy to use and easy to learn? Or are they going to choose one where they have to ask for help in a forum to do basic tasks? Yeah, people will learn stuff if they are sufficiently motivated to, but why make people jump through hoops when they could just walk?

Scott M. Stolz

Fri, 09 Dec 2022 07:44:58 -0500

Well, this is the attitude of a new user. I'm relatively new to Hubzilla and streams. I work my way through it and I encourage others to do the same. It's good that people are able to provide assistance when the can but it's clear that trial and error will yield results every time.

I'm a relatively new user too, but I am also thinking as a person who is promoting and trying to enhance this platform.

It comes down to this: Give people what they want, and they will be more likely to come. Be better than your competitors, and they will be more likely to come.

If competing platforms provide a better user experience, people will tend to flock towards those platforms. That is exactly why platforms like Facebook and Twitter took over social media. They were easy to learn and use.

There is always a learning curve when you start something new. But considering that competing platforms have figured out ways to make their user interface more user friendly than ours, we might want to consider making some improvements.

And I am not just saying that. I am actually working on some new themes. Most of the interface can be fixed by making it easier to find stuff. The feature set is awesome once you figure it out. But with a better user interface, it wouldn't take as long to figure out.